Might be the wrong place to ask this question but it's mine and has been all of it's 10 years of life..
i know it's modem but I never get much sense out of Car Mechanic's forum other than get it scanned, well I have an ODBC II Can scanner which reads error codes just hoping some one may be able to help after all in 10 years cars with EMU will be classic's..
Any way my 2litre cruiser runs some days like a complete bad of hammers and sadly lacks power, it's 110k miles and was reagulary serviced by a garage up to 80k after which i figured the expence out weighted the car. Now i do it to the manual.
It starts well in any weather and always keeps going but of late I get error codes indicating a misfire in the no 1 cylinder,and the EMU light on the dask flashes, like i say runs poorly when hot and often coughs, sounds like back fire in the induction system, if we where talking normal cars I would say there was an inlet valve sticking or burnt but it can run faultlessly for a few days, I think it runs lean because I don't suffer from excessive petrol consumption some owners moan off.
Latest error codes where po134, po300, p0301 and po0301p. we can ignore the po134 because I disconnected the 'upstream' oxygen sensor in the exhause manifold, thinking it may be duff. Did note while scanning the inputs that the CAT said not ready and i know that has a 'down stream' sensor,thinks i should get a ready or is that part of the O2 system in the EMU which is ready. By the way running the car with the upstream sensor disconnected didn't affect running significantly apart from the EMU light coming on.
I noticed that the connector to the upstream sensor had lost its locating tag so tied the connector together with a ty wrap and things have improved over the last few days power wise and torque, but it still coughs when I floor the accelerator, did wonder about timing but how the hell do you check it, the car has a sensor on the cam cover for this I think, never seen any thing round the crankshaft pulley, I did swap to CAM belt in the summer but this problem preceeds any of this work.
Any one any ideas, where to look etc I haven't crawled under the car yet to check the lambda in the cat yet but that's next wher the drives dry.
Any thought's would be greatfully recieved. Manufacturers seem to want to keep details of EMU's wiring etc a black art because my manual which is a Chrysler one doesn't go into this side of the car at all.
PT Cruiser A Classic
Re: PT Cruiser A Classic
I will say this plainly and clearly.
The PT Cruiser is a Chrysler/Dodge Neon under the skin.
There is a good following for PT Cruisers on the internet
with many forums including in the UK.
But I do know that there have been good threads on these
faults on the Neon forums as the USA sites have more cars
and find faults quicker.
Please try http://forums.neons.org/index.php
And you will be looking at all the mk2/2nd gen stuff.
The PT Cruiser is a Chrysler/Dodge Neon under the skin.
There is a good following for PT Cruisers on the internet
with many forums including in the UK.
But I do know that there have been good threads on these
faults on the Neon forums as the USA sites have more cars
and find faults quicker.
Please try http://forums.neons.org/index.php
And you will be looking at all the mk2/2nd gen stuff.
I'm Diabetic,& disabled BUT!! NOT DEAD YET!!
-
vintagemotor
- Posts: 278
- Joined: Fri Sep 23, 2011 3:19 pm
- Location: wouldn't you like to know
Re: PT Cruiser A Classic
Would be interesting with a Charger SRT8 under the hood 
“It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena"
Re: PT Cruiser A Classic
Please don't joke about a v8 in these cars, I'm almost finished fittingvintagemotor wrote:Would be interesting with a Charger SRT8 under the hood
a v6 into the engine bay of my neon and the PT's have the same size
bay and it is tight squeeze for the Chrysler's EGA 3301cc V6.
(please see link http://www.practicallyclassics.co.uk/vi ... f=12&t=138)
I'm Diabetic,& disabled BUT!! NOT DEAD YET!!
Re: PT Cruiser A Classic
There is no black art when it comes to your car. It uses OBDII which is a standardized system that has been around since 1996 in order to generate trouble codes that are fired from your Engine's computer when it detects a problem. It's the second generation system that came about in order to help people in the motor trade diagnose problems with cars without having to use propitiatory systems.
Simple OBDII readers can be had for as little as $50 and will read the codes that have been tripped and reset the check engine lights.
More advanced versions will read live data, this means real time readings such as your oil temp, air temp, 02 sensor readings etc.
Your car uses distributor less ignition which usually means there is a crank position sensor that monitors the speed of rotation of the engine and provides feedback to the computer. The computer will then control the firing order of the plugs through coil packs. This is how all modern engines work and the timing is controlled by the computer. It cannot be adjusted but will self adjust based on what the computer reads (fuel grade, temp readings, speed etc).
PO300, PO301 indicate that you have a misfire on cylinder #1 so I would pay attention to the coil pack, plug wire and spark plug on that cylinder first.
I'm suspecting that as you only had a code on cylinder #1, then you either have individual coil packs for each cylinder (although some cars have a coil packs for every two cylinders). If your car has a coil pack per cylinder, then move the coil pack on cylinder #1 to cylinder # 2 and see if your engine starts tripping the PO302 codes. If not, then switch the plug wires over and see if it does and then replace the plug (probably want to do that first as it's cheap).
If this does not resolve the problem, then I would look for a blocked cat which can cause horrible performance but may not trip a code as most cars have O2 sensors mounted ahead of the cat but not behind it.
As you mentioned that you put a timing belt on it, check the timing marks on the belt and make sure that you put it on right, if your cam timing is out, then it will create a miss, have horrible performance and throw codes. There will not be anything that the cars computer can do to adjust for it.
Good luck.
Simple OBDII readers can be had for as little as $50 and will read the codes that have been tripped and reset the check engine lights.
More advanced versions will read live data, this means real time readings such as your oil temp, air temp, 02 sensor readings etc.
Your car uses distributor less ignition which usually means there is a crank position sensor that monitors the speed of rotation of the engine and provides feedback to the computer. The computer will then control the firing order of the plugs through coil packs. This is how all modern engines work and the timing is controlled by the computer. It cannot be adjusted but will self adjust based on what the computer reads (fuel grade, temp readings, speed etc).
PO300, PO301 indicate that you have a misfire on cylinder #1 so I would pay attention to the coil pack, plug wire and spark plug on that cylinder first.
I'm suspecting that as you only had a code on cylinder #1, then you either have individual coil packs for each cylinder (although some cars have a coil packs for every two cylinders). If your car has a coil pack per cylinder, then move the coil pack on cylinder #1 to cylinder # 2 and see if your engine starts tripping the PO302 codes. If not, then switch the plug wires over and see if it does and then replace the plug (probably want to do that first as it's cheap).
If this does not resolve the problem, then I would look for a blocked cat which can cause horrible performance but may not trip a code as most cars have O2 sensors mounted ahead of the cat but not behind it.
As you mentioned that you put a timing belt on it, check the timing marks on the belt and make sure that you put it on right, if your cam timing is out, then it will create a miss, have horrible performance and throw codes. There will not be anything that the cars computer can do to adjust for it.
Good luck.
Re: PT Cruiser A Classic
^^^WHS^^^
Alabassi is spot on with his view IMHO.
Just to add to that - I'd recommend addressing the misfire PDQ if I were you - As Al says, change the coil pack/leads/plugs etc. Coil packs fail on modern engines with depressing regularity, that'd be my favourite for a misfire.
The reason I say this is that any engine will run badly with a misfire of course, but a modern ECU controlled engine will typically be even worse. This is because the unburnt fuel from the misfiring cylinder will give totally misleading messages to the oxygen sensor, which will detect a lot of oxygen in the exhaust (from the unburnt mixture coming from your misfiring cylinder) and therefore the ECU will think the engine is running lean. The ECU will erroneously try to correct this and give totally wrong mixture instructions to the other cylinders, thus making the engine run badly even on the cylinders that are not misfiring.
The other thing that will happen is that the unburnt fuel will burn in the catalytic converter and if you run it for long like this there's a very high chance of taking the cat out. The Cat normally operates at around 900 degrees, and will melt at around 1100 - 1200 degrees (IIRC) so there's a fairly small margin between normal operating temperature and melt-down. Unburnt fuel will ignite in the cat (even at normal operating temperature it's hot enough to ignite fuel) and will then quickly raise the temperature to well above the danger level. This will then give you a faulty/blocked cat which further complicates the diagnosis of the fault you have - i.e. I've come across cases where the misfire is cured, but the engine still runs like a bag of spanners because the cat is blocked.
Alabassi is spot on with his view IMHO.
Just to add to that - I'd recommend addressing the misfire PDQ if I were you - As Al says, change the coil pack/leads/plugs etc. Coil packs fail on modern engines with depressing regularity, that'd be my favourite for a misfire.
The reason I say this is that any engine will run badly with a misfire of course, but a modern ECU controlled engine will typically be even worse. This is because the unburnt fuel from the misfiring cylinder will give totally misleading messages to the oxygen sensor, which will detect a lot of oxygen in the exhaust (from the unburnt mixture coming from your misfiring cylinder) and therefore the ECU will think the engine is running lean. The ECU will erroneously try to correct this and give totally wrong mixture instructions to the other cylinders, thus making the engine run badly even on the cylinders that are not misfiring.
The other thing that will happen is that the unburnt fuel will burn in the catalytic converter and if you run it for long like this there's a very high chance of taking the cat out. The Cat normally operates at around 900 degrees, and will melt at around 1100 - 1200 degrees (IIRC) so there's a fairly small margin between normal operating temperature and melt-down. Unburnt fuel will ignite in the cat (even at normal operating temperature it's hot enough to ignite fuel) and will then quickly raise the temperature to well above the danger level. This will then give you a faulty/blocked cat which further complicates the diagnosis of the fault you have - i.e. I've come across cases where the misfire is cured, but the engine still runs like a bag of spanners because the cat is blocked.
Some people are like Slinkies - they serve no useful purpose, but they still bring a smile to your face when you push them downstairs.
Re: PT Cruiser A Classic
Before spending any dosh it may be worth just going round all the connections and making sure they are good.
My old Saab 9K was always having such a problem with the MAF sensor. I kept a small aerosol of terminal cleaner in the car.
My old Saab 9K was always having such a problem with the MAF sensor. I kept a small aerosol of terminal cleaner in the car.
Re: PT Cruiser A Classic
So a V8 in a Cruiser, don't know about the Charger but I had a thought a while ago, my wife thought I was mental. How about a Jag V8 and box pointing down the car to a Jag IRS, drop tube front axle and Lakes side pipe's, might need a transmission tunnel and a bit of bashing about but!!
I have a Daimler Soveriegn in various boxes and bits more to paint so really need to keep the Cruiser intact at the mo! I need to get to work, I find the problem more irratating than any thing else as it just keeps going.
Have had blocked CAT mentioned before now and would assume it would be like ramming a potatoe up the exhaust, the car will do 80 on the M1 going to work so at that speed would assume I'm getting good gas flow, how would I check it, take it off and peer down it, I don't even know what I would expect to see.
Had a look at the Neon site looks good but being a phillistein I'm not that clued up on modern engine management, it would seem experts have difficulty some times.
Going to check electrical connections to the sensors, the plug leads and take the plugs out and have a look but some days it's fine others not. TBH I don't know if I know what I'm looking for but my Jag Enthusiast Mag recons 90% of problems with EMU's are down to bad connections and dodgy supplies, the car had a new battery last winter, original lasted 9 years.
I have a Daimler Soveriegn in various boxes and bits more to paint so really need to keep the Cruiser intact at the mo! I need to get to work, I find the problem more irratating than any thing else as it just keeps going.
Have had blocked CAT mentioned before now and would assume it would be like ramming a potatoe up the exhaust, the car will do 80 on the M1 going to work so at that speed would assume I'm getting good gas flow, how would I check it, take it off and peer down it, I don't even know what I would expect to see.
Had a look at the Neon site looks good but being a phillistein I'm not that clued up on modern engine management, it would seem experts have difficulty some times.
Going to check electrical connections to the sensors, the plug leads and take the plugs out and have a look but some days it's fine others not. TBH I don't know if I know what I'm looking for but my Jag Enthusiast Mag recons 90% of problems with EMU's are down to bad connections and dodgy supplies, the car had a new battery last winter, original lasted 9 years.
Re: PT Cruiser A Classic
Just a thought at the last MOT in August the emisions where fine and has been all it's life, would have thought excessive unburnt fuel would be picked up, this problem is long standing predating the CAM belt change and MOT etc, just never bothered to think about fixing it till now.. my wife ran the car for about 3 years and she says it's always been like that, I got it back in March when I took the Jag off the road so we could be talking years..
Re: PT Cruiser A Classic
Re-reading your original post, tie-wrapping the connector back may have located the problem.
You say that it made some improvement - but is the connection as good as it should be?
On a totally different tack, have you had a look at the spark plugs and checked the gaps? Have you re-newed them since starting to have this problem?
Sorry if I seem to be teaching Granny to suck eggs, but I always like to do the simple things first as they cost nothing and can be done pretty quickly - you don't seem to mention doing anything like this, hence I ask the question.
You say that it made some improvement - but is the connection as good as it should be?
On a totally different tack, have you had a look at the spark plugs and checked the gaps? Have you re-newed them since starting to have this problem?
Sorry if I seem to be teaching Granny to suck eggs, but I always like to do the simple things first as they cost nothing and can be done pretty quickly - you don't seem to mention doing anything like this, hence I ask the question.