PAS solution for ADO17 with alternator?

[JPB]

This is probably a question for Mr Penguin 45, but feel free to beat him to it!
I've searched at the most excellent Landcrab Club forum but can't find an answer to this.

Is it possible to fit PAS to a "Landcrab" - in this case a 1969 Morris 1800 - whose owner's garage man** has fitted an alternator to replace a totally shot dynamo?
Brackets, fluid pipes and an alternative pump c/w reservoir are all things that have been investigated and would allow an alternative pump to be driven by a longer alternator belt, the pipes can be made up locally and yes, the car used to feel great with PAS, especially with its aftermarket tiny steering wheel fitted, but the garage bloke who binned the dynamo and the PAS drive coupling when they fitted the alternator have ceased to communicate with the car's owner so it's about to become a rescue job with added (potential) unpleasantness.

[suffolkpete]

I would have thought the steering rack would have been the hardest part. The Wolseley 18/85 had PAS as standard (and a smaller steering wheel than the Morris/Austin), so the rack from that would fit if you can find one, or maybe a rack from a 2200 landcrab. The pump from, say, a "wedge" could probably be made to fit with suitable bracketry and pipework and a long belt. I have a vague recollection of someone on a Rover forum using an electrically powered hydraulic pump, I believe from a Vauxhall.

[JPB]

Thanks Pete, but the problem isn't the rack, which is the car's original factory option as fitted from new, the problem is that the dynamo and the coupling, along with the original pump have been "lost" by the chap who fitted the alternator. The general consensus is that she's best off keeping the alternator as he actually did a proper job of wiring it all in and it will be more confidence inspiring than a dynamo would have been but of course the alternator has no means of connecting to the o/e PAS pump, or wouldn't have, had the pump not been binned with the pump still attached to it.

[suffolkpete]

Another tale of garage incompetence, all too common on forums. Were there no B series landcrabs with PAS and alternator? I'd investigate the electric pump option, they were fitted to Peugeots and Vauxhalls around the turn of the millennium.

[JPB]

Were there no B series landcrabs with PAS and alternator?

This is what I'm hoping the forum's resident ADO17 guru will be able to tell us, but in fact, the more I think about the situation, the less worrying I find it since I'm sure that there were B series ADO71s with PAS and an alternator (I'm certain that no "Wedge" would have anything other than an alternator as even the oldest examples are a mere 40ish years of age) but this, or even an ADO17 with the desired combination of alternator and PAS, would be a pretty long shot and I've been eyeing up the spare PAS pump from my spare Toyota Corolla, a slim body, integrated reservoir and known to work are most of the essential positives. The downsides:
Toyotas of that era use Metric threads throughout, I don't know whether the Aisin pump's delivery rate will match the appetite of the rack on the 1800, the Japanese pump has TOYOTA stamped into its steel reservoir and will be in a very prominent position if it ends up being adapted for BMC duty. Now, if the 1800 were mine, I'd not mind but the owner's late husband was the sort of dedicated anorak who'd argue that anything Japanese found on a BMC product must come from a Datsun.

[Penguin45]

Hi John,

You'd have to improvise based on the 1.8 Princess. The pump belt runs on the water pump belt; I think the pump itself is mounted on a bracket at the bottom of the engine, but I've no specific information. Might be worth chasing up Vulgalour and seeing what he kept from car that got broken.

A slight caveat is that the steering becomes overly-light and lifeless in standard form. I've driven a couple of p/s 'Crabs and it almost felt as if the car was trying to oversteer.

That said, I have a number of 'Crab p/s parts stashed away, including a re-con dynamo, coupling, hoses etc. I don't have a rack. There are two pumps, both of which were noisy, so would need some ministartions before they could be used.

Drop me a PM if any of that lot might solve the problem!

Chris,
P45.

[JPB]

Thanks Chris, that's all very positive stuff and I may well be in touch if I don't find someone locally who has a stash of BMC/BL bits of a certain age. The local car club to which I belong contains at least half a dozen folk who may be able to come up with Wedge stuff as they were among those who pooled their resources to buy the contents of the old parts department at a garage which dealt in various of the BL constituent brands as recently as the late eighties, long after the premises had become a dealership for a well known Japanese marque.
It would feel satisfying to be able to do the job using authentic BL parts from a later model and yes, I know how these feel when equipped with PAS but TBH, my personal preference - quite apart from the subject vehicle's owner's clinical need - is for the power steering as its effect of numbing the car's initial understeer, felt as the tall sidewalls of the original tyres deflect in a hard bend, gives the car a feel that is, ironically, more similar to some 1990s/early 2000s modern cars. The difference is similar in its impact to the difference between a MK3 Golf without PAS and the same model with and although this gives the impression of a car that may oversteer, I like the sensation of improved turn in, even though it's only the steering feel that's different. I especially enjoy a PAS-equipped Landcrab with a tiny steering wheel but the sad fact of the matter is that, once the car is made ready for service again, its owner will be the one who benefits from the work and I'll have to settle for a consolation ride in the back seat once the time comes.
To me, that's a big deal as these are one of a very small quantity of cars in which I can sit in the back behind a long legged driver and as the owner is all of five feet tall, I'll feel like Lord Sugar sitting in there with all of that space around me.


Thanks again.

[Penguin45]

I have just checked on the parts listing and there appears to be an 1800 set up on the very last cars with the pump mounted at the bottom. It looks like all components are different from those currently fitted, with the exception of the rack.



HTH,

P45.

[JPB]

Thanks yet again, Chris, that's a very useful illustration because it shows the shape of the bracket required which would help to recreate something authentic. It's also useful because the proportions and style of the pump/reservoir assembly make that appear very similar in style to the Toyota item that I can donate to the project as they're cheap, very easy to find and tend not to go wrong. It's good to have options!

[Penguin45]

I think that's what carried over to the 1800 Princess, so that might give you a bit more scope. Toyota fittings will almost certainly be metric though - hoses, not just nuts and bolts.

Cheers,
P45.