brake pipe flaring tool?

[sierra3dr]

What does your brake flaring tool look like?
Are there any that I should steer clear of?

[arceye]

I have one of these, http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Draper-Automo ... 19c746ae50 don't rate it much and seem to go through the dies quite regularly when the guide pin breaks off them.

Used one of the type below a while back and it was great in comparison, but don't know the exact manufacturer of the one I used but may well have been the same as the one in the link below

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Franklin-Tool ... 259664cbeb

But for my money I'd try to pick one these with the right dies fo what you are doing, I used to have one but lost it in the move up here but always found it to do the job properly and well

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/sykes-pickava ... 2a4812a826

Well, thats my thoughts, and it reminds me I either need to get another or at least replace the die for my draper again before I find I need to make a brake pipe

[JPB]

I'd go along with the above but would add that these small, handheld ones are really only practical for copper pipe, which is now illegal for commercial use here as it has been for a while in other countries, though I'd still use it in my own cars provided that they have dual circuit systems with static cylinders because that way, no pigtails are required and they tend to attract MOT testers' attention if they realise why the coils were let in.
For the safer and universally approved Cupro-Nickel pipe, there's really no substitute for one of the decent, vice-mounted kits. Mine was plucked from among some random secondhand gear at a Newby Hall autojumble back in the late '80s and it has no enamel left, has some detectable wear to the threads now but never fails to provide op1 and op2 flares correctly every time it comes out as well as having a built in cutter that doesn't score the pipe end and a wheel for making elegant bends. There's never been a maker's name visible but it's quality and at £7 has covered its rent admirably.

[tractorman]

I have a Laser that seems fine with a big but - it makes quite small "bulbs" (normally on male ends of pipes) but a "double flare" is fine. I had one similar to the second pic in arceye's list some years ago and it only lasted a few years before the "bulbs" were distorted (I bought it when I had the Wolseley - about 1972/3 and threw it away a couple of days ago). I also have one like the first in arceye's list, but getting the pipe set to the perfect length for a good flare is next to impossible - and the 3/16 mandrel broke - so I have more or less given up on it! IIRC, it also made small "bulbs" too - but that didn't matter at the time - I bought it to make some "conduit" for tractor sidelights.

I looked for a pic of the Laser one and it's from Machine Mart's page (I bought mine from someone on eBay for a lot less!)



The notches on the RH of the "mandrel plate" are for setting the length of pipe that sticks out of the jaws - a lot easier than the Draper one!!

A lot of the ones I saw on eBay say they are only suitable for copper. The Machine Mart listing says brass and aluminium pipe can be used, so I suspect that is the reason why my male ends are a bit small - Kunifer is a lot harder to form! Having said that,I've made about eight new pipes for the Landy so far and, after a bit of trial end error (on a spare length of pipe that I used to practice on!), the unions seem to work well - I'll find out when I bleed the system later on!

One thing that does help is finding the right unions for the pipe. I tried to use some of the ones from some new copper pipes I'd bought on Kunifer pipe and, with the small end, the pipe wasn't tight when the union was fully tightened. As I wrote, the "male" end is quite small - and the bore of the copper unions is relatively large. I bought some more unions "to fit Triumph Spitfire" on eBay and they are fine Paddocks also sell the same (narrower bore) unions, so I have ten on order from them!

Of course, the one in arceye's last photo is probably the best by a country mile. There was a similar professional one when I was looking - and it was well over £100!

[sierra3dr]

Brilliant replies there fellas,thanks ever so much. I was contemplating on one of these

going for under a tenner on the bay,I'll take on your experience tractorman and avoid it,and go for the Laser type

op1 and op2 flares

Even better,never knew the flares were named as such

thanks fellas

[Phil P]

The Laser one is very nice and easy to use. Guyson do a good one also. The Sykes Pickavant version is bomb proof but NOT cheap.

[Young Farmer]

I have a flaring tool like the one in Sierra3dr's post,it's the second one that I bought. The first one was ruined when the pointy bit on the end of the screw turned in the former damaging the point which makes the female end. When I bought the second set I welded a bar onto the side of the point preventing it from turning. I have broken a couple of the3/16" dies in the past but if you are careful to make sure that the end of the pipe is straight and square, and protruding by the correct amount , is easy to make reasonably good flares without breaking more pins. Probably the fact that the die is pushed down without turning helps prevent breakage of the pins.
Tractorman try clamping the pipe with a little more pipe protruding and you should get a decent flare. Don't over do it or you will break the pin off the die.
The real answer is the Sykes Pickavant flaring tool. I managed to put a 3/8" flare on a steel power steering pipe on a Ford tractor with one of those. Making car brake pipes was a doddle. The garage where I take my cars for MOT's has one and I am able to borrow it if needed

[sierra3dr]

I had decided to go with this one

But one off ebay,a sealey version. Dies are loose though

[tractorman]

I suspect the loose dies won't be a problem - the cone on the clamp will keep them aligned (assuming you get it located properly!). If worst comes to worst, I've seen new "die strips" on the Bay, so you can replace yours if necessary. I suspect that you could also get dies for metric flares (I gather they are different to imperial ones), so be able to use the tool on moderns as well as "proper" stuff, you can certainly get metric unions for 3/16" pipe! This would probably work on the "cheaper" type of tool too - where the dies are separate and don't seem to be available as spares.

As Young Farmer said, making the pipe stick out more can make a bigger flange, but there is the risk of getting the "pin" of the die stuck in the compressed pipe and breaking it. Part of the pin's job is to stop the pipe closing up when it is compressed and having more pipe showing gives more pipe to compress! I used the setting for 1/4" pipe when making up the 3/16" pipes and it does help a little, but, like everything, trying it yourself is the best way of finding what works best for you!

One thing's for sure, it's a lot easier to use these than the cheap ones with the loose clamp (and fiddly pipe vice thing). I'm getting to the stage where I can do the job without looking (I find three "half turns" - ie 180deg turns - on the handle) is about right for a good end. Don't go too tight - screwing the union up will be the best way of forming the flare to make a perfect fit. Again, this is something you need to work out for yourself, but it is better to check after two or three half-turns and see if you need a little more than find the union is scrap!

[sierra3dr]

superb tractorman thanks