Practically Classics Forum

suffolkpete wrote: I think Neil is in danger of creating a gulf between the "use it every day" brigade and those who see their vehicles purely as a hobby.

Not my intention Pete, although i do think that a lot of the 'i use mine everyday' people seem to think that they are somehow better or in a holier than thou position than those who do not. I think that how often YOU use YOUR car is entirely up to you and not up for discussion. For example, if lived in the same town as i worked i wouldn't need a small fuel efficient modern car for my commute and would happily use my Vitesse everyday.

However i don't, so i need a car that can do over 45mpg as i can't afford to use anything that doesn't due to the mileage i cover each week. If i were richer or had a decent paid job, i probably would use my Triumph as a commuter. However i'm poor with a young family, so i simply can't afford to spend what little money i have needlessly on fuel i needn't be burning just to drive to work and back and to make a point about using my classic.

That said, i don't think i'm less of an enthusiast than someone who does drive their classic everyday, it's my personal financial circumstance that leads me not to. I'm glad that a few of you have actually started to think about Drive It day and what it should stand for. I think we've grown quite complacent about the whole thing.

admin wrote: I think that how often YOU use YOUR car is entirely up to you and not up for discussion.

I really do agree with that. I envy those who can and do use their classics every day, but you make a good point about fuel costs. Personally, I just don't drive very far at all these days, irrespective of what car it's in. When I do, it's often to the builder's merchants to get timber, aggregates, sheeting etc. and while I love my Midget it's not quite as good at transporting 4 metre lengths of timber as my Volvo estate!

Apart from in the depths of winter, when the lack of adequate heating and de-misting becomes an issue, my wife does use her Morris Minor to go to work, as it is in fact quite economical and the lack of performance does't matter too much as the journey is on fairly slow roads anyway. She wouldn't "get" going for a drive on a specific day just to make a point though....

admin wrote:If I ...... had a decent paid job,

Hehe lol. Bauer take note!

when i had classics, i used them as often as possible if they were road legal.. but now ive young family i cant afford it any more. so if you see a someone in a modern waving madly its probably me..

I drive my Beetle every working day, but that's only 10mins each way to the train station most of the time.

I don't see anything wro ng with the concept of a "Drive It Day". While we don't have such a thing here that I'm aware of, we do have a "Drive your Mini Day" and an "International Moke Day" which I participate in.

If all of us who had classics used them all the time, there would be a lot more on the road. We have come round to thinking that you need a modern hack for modern motoring and a classic for a hobby. Why?

....The triumph is from another era in more ways than one, it's a 25mpg if you're gentle car, drive it like they intended you to do and you can empty the tank in no time at all. Not a problem in a hobby car, a big problem if I was to use it every day up and down the M11 in and out of London.

Get a classic, choose it and modify it to cope with modern motoring if it needs it, then use it every day.

..if you need to modify it, then you havent't chosen the right car! The Vitesse needs no 'modification' for daily use, it's just a thirsty car, end of.

There's a huge advantage to owning classics from the 80's and early 90's because they can cope perfectly well with modern motoring and qualify in reality for classic perks.

...as can anything basically from the early sixties onwards, but what stops most people is what stops me, the sheer cost of fuel. My Rover is 16 years old, hardly a new car, basically it's a £300 banger yet it has modern(ish) mpi fuel management and will easily give me 40 to the gallon.I use it for almost all purposes- commuting, shopping, kids taxi, dragging the trailer around, etc, etc. To use the Triumph like that would bankrupt me in no time. If it was my only car it would've been sold by now as just too juicy for daily use. I would have to swap it for something more economical, but as I like the full throttle howl of the straight six it wouldn't be anywhere near as much fun. There are people who do use their old cars all the time, nothing wrong with that, it's just that it's probably easier to do in a mini or an imp or an A35 or a Minor than it is in a RO80 or a Stag or a Jag:I would imagine a lot of people with big engined pre 70's fuel crisis cars are taking it easy and limiting use now !

As for drive it day, it completley passed me by, completely off the radar! It's like talk like a pirate day, a bit meaningless really but a bit of fun. Maybe it would have been better as drive your car round parliament square day- hooting all the time.

bnicho wrote: I don't see anything wro ng with the concept of a "Drive It Day".

I'd agree with that, if it makes owners feel part of something bigger, it unifies drivers of older vehicles regardless of marque, age or come to that what style of vehicle, then that has to be a good thing and should be received wholeheartedly by the folks at PC.

I feel Neil's gripe has more to do with the workings of FHBVC than the concept of Drive it Day.

...The triumph is from another era in more ways than one, it's a 25mpg if you're gentle car, drive it like they intended you to do and you can empty the tank in no time at all. Not a problem in a hobby car, a big problem if I was to use it every day up and down the M11 in and out of London.
if you need to modify it, then you haven't chosen the right car! The Vitesse needs no 'modification' for daily use, it's just a thirsty car, end of.

I'm glad you agree with me, it shows how much common ground there is. I try not to use the SD1 every day - it's perfectly capable of 8mpg, but also able to do at least 25mpg, so it's a bit of a hobby car. Although, it was out every day for work through the snow last Winter.

...as can anything basically from the early sixties onwards, but what stops most people is what stops me, the sheer cost of fuel
I'd have to disagree here. Anything with carb over exhaust and an engine driven cooling fan is likely to struggle. Sit for 1/2 hr in a traffic jamb deciding which is worse, leave it running with a progressively weakening mixture hoping the traffic will get going, or switch it off, it continues to heat up, so weakening the mixture through evaporation to the point where it won't restart.
... My Rover is 16 years old, hardly a new car, basically it's a £300 banger yet it has modern(ish) mpi fuel management and will easily give me 40 to the gallon.I use it for almost all purposes- commuting, shopping, kids taxi, dragging the trailer around, etc, etc.
So it's well on the way to becoming a classic if you want it to. You've made my point for me.

To use the Triumph like that would bankrupt me in no time. If it was my only car it would've been sold by now as just too juicy for daily use. I would have to swap it for something more economical, but as I like the full throttle howl of the straight six it wouldn't be anywhere near as much fun. There are people who do use their old cars all the time, nothing wrong with that, it's just that it's probably easier to do in a mini or an imp or an A35 or a Minor than it is in a RO80 or a Stag or a Jag:I would imagine a lot of people with big engined pre 70's fuel crisis cars are taking it easy and limiting use now !

Lots of us make our choices for different reasons. Most of us choose them I suspect because it's what we want for personal reasons, then have a modern thing for work. My point is that there are so many classics around that you can choose one for work use if you want to in the same way you would pick a diesel focus because it's fuel efficient (I presume) Problem here is that we're revealing that a lot of us have more limited vision than we are prepared to admit when we look at choices, and then say it won't do based on those limited choices. You want 40+mpg, practicality, comfort etc, what about a Citroen BX 14/15/17/19, Peugeot 405 1.6 petrol or 1.9 diesel, Audi 80 1.6 or diesel, mk2 Vw Golf 1.3 or 1.6, Honda Concerto or the equivalent 200 series Rover, Nissan Sunny etc etc.

As for Drive it day. I'm all for it, but I just don't think 1 day a year sends the right message to the general public about the strength of the classic car world. I'd like to see every household in the UK owning and using a classic, and just don't think we promote our philosophy, interest and intent nearly strong enough to the general public.

Anthony

what about a Citroen BX 14/15/17/19

...before the Rover , I ran a BX 17 n/a diesel as a daily drive- that did 50-55mpg easily and was a piece of cake to look after as well, the problem was that if anything at all went wrong I was waiting 2-3 days for bits. There came a point where virtually nothing was available off the shelf- I had loads of spares but it was never what I had that failed.. What ended it's service as a daily drive was a failed heater hose- I had to make one out of bits of odd hose and copper piping, new ones just didn't exist- it worked but spelt the end really. I have to get to work every day, no excuses, and need something I can fix on the day if it does go wrong.

When the car went I sold the parts I had accumulated and they went literally all over Europe- a top end gasket set went to Holland, my hens teeth brake adjuster rebuild kits went to France of all places, the Octopus went to Belgium...... I was lucky in that mine didn't have abs, many did and abs driveshafts are now as far as I'm aware completely non existent and many BX's have been scrapped because of the non availability of these. This is the problem with non-established classics and classics in waiting....at least I can still get bits for the Rover at the local factors

[/quote]I feel Neil's gripe has more to do with the workings of FHBVC than the concept of Drive it Day. [/quote]

Fraid not, i've only ever found them to be more than helpful in my dealings with them. I have no beef with them at all, but as i'm a classic car owner and driver, they don't represent me anyway. They represent the clubs of which i am a member. That's why they are called the Federation of British Historic Vehicle Clubs. I think it is a mistake to think they represent you as an individual. They don't, they only represent the clubs that choose to pay a sub to them.

The main problem i have is with that awful name.

mr rusty wrote:

If all of us who had classics used them all the time, there would be a lot more on the road. We have come round to thinking that you need a modern hack for modern motoring and a classic for a hobby. Why?

....The triumph is from another era in more ways than one, it's a 25mpg if you're gentle car, drive it like they intended you to do and you can empty the tank in no time at all. Not a problem in a hobby car, a big problem if I was to use it every day up and down the M11 in and out of London.

I drove a Vitesse as my everyday car until I got the Rover P6, The Triumph averaged 27mpg with anything but gentle driving while the Rover does 26mpg. Plenty of modern cars are just as heavy on fuel, but have depreciation costs too. So a Vitesse is perfectly suitable for a regular commute - along suitable roads. I'm lucky in having 12 mile commute on a pleasant A road through the countryside with no traffic jams. I'd think again I had London or motorway traffic to contend with.

mr rusty wrote:

Get a classic, choose it and modify it to cope with modern motoring if it needs it, then use it every day.

..if you need to modify it, then you havent't chosen the right car! The Vitesse needs no 'modification' for daily use, it's just a thirsty car, end of.

I disagree, it benefits hugely from an electric fan and electronic ignition - and becomes less thirsty as a result!
(and I hoped that stupid MP has killed off "end of" for ever)